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NeedToKnow.today

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This is NEED TO KNOW. Real talk about the\h
reality of Unidentified Anomalous Phenomena.\h\h

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From Australia Ross Coulthart;  from the U.S. Bryce\h
Zabel. Well it's good to be back and we have had\h\h

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something of an absence and I think that requires\h
some explanation so I'm going to bring my co-host\h\h

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buddy and good colleague Bryce in to explain\h
what's been going on. Well there's a lot been\h\h

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going on and we could lay it off too well we've\h
been doing an intense investigation but what\h\h

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actually happened is my daughter came back home\h
from a trip and had gotten, what do we call\h\h

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it?, a strep throat from a karaoke session so I got\h
it, then two days later my wife shows up and she's\h\h

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got Covid and now I have Covid and strep throat so\h
yeah I kind of went into about a two-week tunnel\h\h

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where it was all I could do to get up in the\h
morning and then go back to bed. But now I\h\h

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feel better I'm back uh and I'm ready! Now we're\h
doing this recording on March the 15th which is\h\h

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an auspicious date in history Bryce the The Ides\h
of March notable in Rome is a time of settling\h\h

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debts and also apparently maybe you can refresh\h
my memory yeah some little little thing like the\h\h

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assassination of Julius Caesar I think happened\h
on on that time in 44 BC uh I don't know that\h\h

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we'll be as auspicious today as Caesar's passing\h
probably was but I'm willing to give it a try\h\h

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so listen it's been quite a news time in the\h
period since we last spoke and I I think one\h\h

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of the things that fascinates me is particularly\h
from The Daily Mail Josh Boswell Christopher sharp\h\h

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Liberation times there's been a lot of talk\h
that we're going to see Congressional hearings\h\h

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there's a lot of speculation about a new push\h
in Congress for public hearings into purported\h\h

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secret UAP reverse engineering programs which is a\h
a big claim and um I know louisando has made a new\h\h

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statement as well where he's basically applauded\h
efforts to get to the bottom of any Legacy efforts\h\h

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to exploit UAP materials and he said not just\h
looking at Lockheed Martin I would not limit\h\h

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the focus of the inquiry to just one Aerospace\h
company but to several others that have paid a\h\h

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key historical role in this endeavor so we're\h
being told my friend that there is an ongoing\h\h

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push behind the scenes for people to come forward\h
and for possibly in you know the increased chance\h\h

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of public hearings you know the thing Ross that\h
is funny about that Lou Elizondo uh statement that\h\h

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you read where he says I applaud the effort to\h
get to the bottom of any Legacy efforts to exploit\h\h

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blah blah blah and then ending where you you just\h
said for a guy that keeps quoting his NDA I can't\h\h

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talk about this I can't talk about that he always\h
manages to literally State what he means which in\h\h

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this case if he's saying I would also go one step\h
further and not limit the focus of the inquiry to\h\h

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just one Aerospace company but to several others\h
that have played a key role well okay I guess Lou\h\h

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Elizondo is coming right out and saying yeah\h
there's crash wreckage out there and there are\h\h

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Legacy programs that have been looking into it\h
and some of them are private Aerospace so you\h\h

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know to the extent I know people fall into the\h
pro Lou and anti-loo column these days which is\h\h

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unfortunate but if you trust what Lou Elizondo\h
is saying he's saying it again there's crash\h\h

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wreckage there's private companies that have been\h
looking into it and he thinks it's about time to\h\h

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do that so the only question I had about what\h
you just said though is yeah there is a lot of\h\h

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speculation about these uh the possibility of more\h
public hearings but my question is who's doing all\h\h

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this speculating you know where where is the heart\h
of the speculation uh and and how informed is it\h\h

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look it's a good question and and one of the\h
issues is that frankly none of us really know\h\h

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none of us really know for sure I mean a\h
lot of people myself included are being\h\h

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encouraged to the belief that there is a push\h
towards a greater disclosure in the Congress\h\h

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and frankly I'm not sure we should buy it I'm\h
I'm very very skeptical about a lot of what\h\h

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we're being told at the moment I mean for example\h
let's just deal with one thing um and I think this\h\h

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is quite important because it's kind of slipped\h
through the cracks in the news language recently\h\h

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what I can tell you Bryce is that I know for\h
a fact that there are people who have given\h\h

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evidence to Congress in camera who purport to\h
have knowledge of the program and there are\h\h

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people who are coming forward who purport to have\h
knowledge of the program if the program exists\h\h

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I think we should all maintain severe skepticism\h\h

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um just to correct just to go deeper skepticism\h
about the fact that a program existed or\h\h

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skepticism about the fact that they're actually\h
ready to have public hearings of some kind\h\h

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both all right both I mean I I still think we need\h
to be very very strict with ourselves in testing\h\h

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claims that are being made um so let's for example\h
I mean one of the things that just bobbed up in\h\h

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the news in the last few days is and you've got to\h
you've got to figure this out by putting together\h\h

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various bits of a jigsaw but it's very clear\h
that representative Tim Burchette and Matt Gates\h\h

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uh to Republican congressmen appear\h
to have attended a classified UAP\h\h

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briefing on a military base somewhere in\h
Florida on or around February the 21st and\h\h

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um I think this is an important story because\h
it's illustrative of what's going on behind the\h\h

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scenes neither of them can talk about it in all\h
that much detail publicly but what we do know is\h\h

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um Matt Gates first came out and he's a\h
controversial figure because he's done some\h\h

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pretty wacky and said some pretty wacky things\h
in his time he came up and he's a member of the\h\h

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House armed services committee so he does have the\h
right to be briefed on these UAP issues because\h\h

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the house armed services committee is one of the\h
Committees that is dealing with this UAP issue\h\h

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and I know that staffers on that committee are\h
engaging with people inviting them to come forward\h\h

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anyway in a discussion on Newsmax the news\h
organization Gates talked about how he'd seen\h\h

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evidence of a mysterious craft that did not appear\h
to belong to the U.S its allies or adversaries and\h\h

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he said I have seen evidence of craft that\h
I am not familiar with any of our allies or\h\h

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adversaries or even of our country possessing\h
I've seen that craft taken by air Crews I think\h\h

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it means photograph who've gotten quite close to\h
it and we've got a lot more questions about why\h\h

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this information isn't more broadly available to\h
the American people if there's stuff flying over\h\h

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our skies and we don't know about it whether it's\h
Chinese or whether it's unworldly I think we need\h\h

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a lot more transparency and we've actually got\h
a group of Congress members together and we're\h\h

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going to be conducting a lot more investigations\h
and trying to get this information before the\h\h

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public so that we can have a lot more assessment\h
of the Threat Level and the risk level so that's\h\h

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why people are talking about public hearings Gates\h
has talked about it on the Newsmax Channel sure\h\h

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and his comments also followed an interview with\h
Newsweek magazine when Congressman Tim burchett\h\h

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um he basically told Newsweek that he believed\h
quote we have recovered a craft at some point and\h\h

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possible beings I think that a lot of that's being\h
reverse engineered right now but we just don't\h\h

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understand it he said and in the same interview\h
with Matt Gates Tim Birch had appeared as well on\h\h

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the news Max interview and he admitted he was in\h
a meeting together with Gates the previous day in\h\h

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Florida that was the key word and he said I can't\h
talk about it it was classified top secret so I\h\h

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can't talk about it and then to complete the next\h
bit of the jigsaw puzzle that was all that Richard\h\h

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could say about the briefing he received but then\h
Fox news's Tucker Carlson did an interview with a\h\h

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podcast called Full Max in which he described a\h
recent conversation with a congressman who went\h\h

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to a briefing in the state of Florida and I\h
I think it's reasonable to speculate that's\h\h

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got to be birchette and by implication also Gates\h
who's also talked about being briefed in Florida\h\h

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and Carlson told the podcast four of these\h
things like a raptor pilot an American pilot\h\h

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took these images of these objects right next to\h
his plane and then he goes on to talk about how\h\h

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they got a thermal read on them and the thermal\h
read was at the bottom of the plane and frankly\h\h

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what Carlson says doesn't quite make a lot of\h
sense but my takeaway is that both birchette\h\h

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and Gates appear to have been shown classified\h
images at a Florida base of some kind probably\h\h

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an Air Force Base and these craft are four\h
anomalous craft photographed right next to\h\h

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U.S aircraft and they were shown this allegedly by\h
quote a Commanding General well that's there's a\h\h

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lot to unpack and what you just said um and first\h
of all folks before I go any further please don't\h\h

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send me email about being a partisan on this whole\h
thing look Gates is controversial as as Ross said\h\h

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um and I wish that the same statement was coming\h
from somebody a little less to one Spectrum or the\h\h

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other because it would it would sort of help\h
with the credibility of it I wonder and and\h\h

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Ross is a good question I think is is the issue\h
starting to be politicized are we starting to see\h\h

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Republicans drift into one column and Democrats\h
into another I'm not quite sure but I I had a lot\h\h

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of questions when we were talking about this\h
initially which is why Gates and Burchette\h\h

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why Florida uh you know because if you're going\h
to be getting a deep briefing traditionally that\h\h

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happens in one of those secure compartmentalized\h
information facilities uh under the capitol or\h\h

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somewhere in DC and uh instead of a Florida Air\h
Force Base so these are the things I'm thinking\h\h

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about but I you know as the as the historian\h
here I just wanted to throw one thing out\h\h

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because later on we were going to talk about some\h
of the things that happened uh 50 years ago in\h\h

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1973 well 50 years ago in 1973 it's reputed that\h
there was another historic visit by two people uh\h\h

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involved in uh one of who was heavily involved in\h
Washington politics to a Florida Air Force Base\h\h

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I'm talking about the Homestead Air Force Base\h
visit supposedly where Richard Nixon took his\h\h

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buddy a comedian Jackie Gleason in the middle of\h
the night and took him to Homestead Air Force Base\h\h

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and introduced them to some wreckage and some\h
bodies nobody he's ever been able to tie that\h\h

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down but uh what's that allegedly no totally\h
allegedly uh no one's ever been able to tie\h\h

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that down but Gleason to the end of his days\h
always said it happened no one else has laid\h\h

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it out like that I'm just I'm just throwing it\h
out there as as just yeah these things come up\h\h

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but let me go back to these questions I'd love to\h
hear what your thoughts are why them why Florida\h\h

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okay temperature it's been quite prominent\h
in speaking out on this issue uh and he's\h\h

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been pushing you know he's been he's been\h
he's been asking for briefings and and\h\h

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um he's on the house oversight and accountability\h
committee so I guess to some degree he has a right\h\h

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to ask and Matt Gates of course is on the um\h
Services committee on the house so he has an\h\h

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absolute right to ask as a Committee Member\h
so maybe it's as simple as they've asked for\h\h

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a briefing we just don't know because Heston\h
burchett says it's all top secret and they've\h\h

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probably transgressed by even talking about it\h
what intrigues me is I'm aware of other people\h\h

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who've received similar briefings and you know\h
this has been going on this is what's happening\h\h

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at the moment behind the scenes is there are these\h
kind of briefings happening people congressmen\h\h

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um key opinion leaders are being shown information\h
and I just wonder what the agenda is like what's\h\h

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driving this um I have a I have a suspicion that\h
part of what is driving this is an attempt to\h\h

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contain I wish it was a Content an attempt to\h
to disclose or just for God's sake just let's\h\h

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just get a clear breast of what the hell is going\h
on here and bring it all out into the open and we\h\h

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can test the data look at the evidence and make\h
a judgment about whether any of this is true\h\h

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but I I somebody's playing a game behind\h
the scenes and I I don't like it I really\h\h

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don't like it I agree with you that ultimately if\h
it's okay to show two politicians four allegedly\h\h

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anomalous objects sitting next to a U.S Air Force\h
uh fighter jet or maybe it was a Navy fighter jet\h\h

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um uh why the hell can't the public see it\h
and okay there might be there might be some\h\h

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reason there might be something to do with the\h
sensor systems or the the capabilities of U.S\h\h

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photographic reconnaissance which means that it's\h
not it's not allowed to show the public because\h\h

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to do so would reveal systems or Technologies\h
which can't be revealed but I'm told that in\h\h

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many cases what these are are photographs taken\h
by pilots with good old-fashioned a-type mobile\h\h

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phones you know so why the hell can't we see this\h
stuff and and rather than baiting us and getting\h\h

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people like Matt Gates and Timber Chet to put out\h
claims on on U.S national media which frankly sink\h\h

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and disappear without Trace um why not just put\h
it out there I mean essentially if the U.S Air\h\h

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Force is briefing people let's see it let's see\h
the briefing material I mean I got to tell you\h\h

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well you know this above above anybody but most\h
of our listeners and viewers do as well I'm just\h\h

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a radical on this subject I've just I'm fed up\h
this has been 75 to 80 years where this has been\h\h

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going on and I you know you release one Crystal\h
Clear photo or one fantastically uh clear video\h\h

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and it's it's not game over but it's at least\h
we've switched from do they exist don't they\h\h

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exist what are they can we if you see one of these\h
things in in in the shocking reality that other\h\h

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people have seen then I think we would move to a\h
new phase very quickly you know it's so yeah we\h\h

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should get that done there's absolutely no reason\h
that the American public and the world Community\h\h

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have not seen some crystal clear photos taken\h
by the militaries of the world and that would\h\h

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not necessarily ruin anybody's day when it came to\h
uh you know keeping track of the tech technology\h\h

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they have and not wanting to share it with their\h
adversaries the second part of that though is that\h\h

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the outlines of what these photos and and various\h
things are have emerged from a pilot testimony\h\h

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they just don't have access to being able to show\h
us the the the film and the or the video and the\h\h

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photos that they have seen for example Ryan\h
Graves who we all know is a jet fighter pilot\h\h

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who now has a really terrific podcast of his own\h
called merged I mean he describes a couple of jets\h\h

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flying along together and a thing flies between\h
them and that thing I'm quoting now was an object\h\h

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that was quote dark gray or Black Cube inside of a\h
clear sphere now I'm come on let's see that photo\h\h

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that photo exists why can't we see it I mean\h
it's just irritating I'm an irritated man over\h\h

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this topic I'm never gonna get over it I'm never\h
going to stop agitating for it and I you know I\h\h

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don't care whether you're a skeptic or a Believer\h
or somewhere in between on the Spectrum we paid\h\h

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for the aircraft and the systems that are able to\h
gather this information we did not give somebody\h\h

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a blank check and say never ever let us know\h
what you get with it we've actually financed\h\h

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it and it's time to at least stop this so if\h
there are going to be public hearings they can\h\h

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start the public hearing with the single great\h
photo and I would I'd be a happy man yeah I'm\h\h

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not 100 sure by the way that that particular\h
incident where the object flew between the two\h\h

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Jets I don't think they've ever said that there's\h
an actual photograph of that happening but I do\h\h

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think that there are images and sensor system data\h
that from all of those incidents off to the east\h\h

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coast and the west coast and just while we're on\h
the the issue of what's been seen by U.S Navy Jets\h\h

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um it's really interesting just in the last few\h
hours our friends at the male Josh Boswell from\h\h

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the males broken a story in the Daily Mail which\h
I think he's applied a little bit of stick to what\h\h

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Jay Stratton said but essentially the former head\h
of the government's UFO task force Jay Stratton\h\h

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and uh Travis Taylor the chief scientist on that\h
task force they spoke at aliencon in Pasadena\h\h

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Pasadena in early March and they talked about the\h
fact that they'd investigated the objects that\h\h

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buzzed around a fleet of eight Navy ships off the\h
U.S West Coast in July of 2019 and remember Bryce\h\h

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this is the stuff that you and I in our special\h
with Spotlight we went to Jeremy core Bill's\h\h

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um office and we actually investigated with Jeremy\h
what what was being looked at for example the\h\h

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weird objects over the USS Omaha and the splash\h
splash splash video where the object appears to go\h\h

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into the ocean now at aliencon both Stratton and\h
Taylor left them worried that whatever this was it\h\h

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was a conclusion that Russia or China could have\h
achieved some kind of incredible drone Battery\h\h

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Technology or maybe they'd launched quadcoppers\h
quadcopters from submarines that somehow evaded\h\h

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the Navy's best radar miles from the mainland\h
but what what the daily mail says is that the\h\h

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story uh that was put by the Pentagon to the\h
Congress and this is a very serious allegation\h\h

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essentially um the story that was put by the\h
Pentagon bosses to the politicians in the public\h\h

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last year and the speech to Congress it suggested\h
that what Jay Stratton told alien con was\h\h

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that this was a misrepresentation to the\h
Congress I.E that the former head of the\h\h

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UFO Task Force is is allegedly stating that\h
Congress was deliberately misled by Scott Bray\h\h

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the deputy director of Naval intelligence\h
and Ronald Moultrie the under secretary of\h\h

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defense for intelligence and security when they\h
testified to the house intelligence committee and\h\h

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um this matters Bryce and I think it\h
requires explanation because apparently\h\h

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um the Department's now saying it stands by\h
the testimony given by Bray and Moultrie but\h\h

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um Taylor Travis Taylor said he and Stratton\h
watched the presentation at their new employees\h\h

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employers Radiance Technologies and when they\h
started talking about the USS Russell incident\h\h

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Travis says quote I was like we did not brief\h
him that way this is this is not what we told\h\h

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him it really really did upset both Travis and\h
me when we were watching that hearing Stratton\h\h

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added I would not have gone and briefed Congress\h
that I believe these triangular shaped objects\h\h

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to be real without my ducks in a row and the\h
ability to answer any question thrown at me\h\h

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and this is important this matters because has a\h
misrepresentation been made to Congress that's the\h\h

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worry well yes it has um you know let's forget\h
the Daily Mail as the source of it they people\h\h

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attack them for the type of newspaper they\h
are but at least they're boldly going out\h\h

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there look at the source instead the sources\h
are Jay Stratton and Travis Taylor who are\h\h

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pretty impeccable sources and you know just one\h
thought it wasn't a speech to Congress in in my\h\h

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view on May 17th of 2022 it was sworn testimony\h
tenderness it wasn't sworn actually it's funny I\h\h

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went back and double checked this yeah they were\h
not put under oath and I I really think this is\h\h

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important neither Moultrie nor Bray were put under\h
oath but by golly if if they have misled Congress\h\h

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that's a worry I not only is it a worry if I\h
was uh in Congress and it looks like some of\h\h

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the people who are in Congress are equally as\h
ticked off um I would just say I'm not taking\h\h

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people in for a public hearing on something and\h
letting them lie and or misrepresent to us and\h\h

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I would hold them accountable but uh obviously\h
if there are going to be public hearings in the\h\h

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future uh they better start with somebody holding\h
up their hand and swearing to tell the whole truth\h\h

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and nothing but the truth so help them whatever\h
so I think it is time to start swearing people in\h\h

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because how else do you hold them accountable and\h
but but the other thing about this is it you and\h\h

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I knew this in fact most people who watched that\h
hearing we said how in the world could a topic\h\h

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this complex with this much data that's been come\h
up with over the past seven to eight decades how\h\h

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could you start as these guys did and and take\h
the position that they took and and frankly most\h\h

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people on that committee let them get away\h
with it even the people who knew that they\h\h

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were prevaricating or at least misleading so yeah\h
the whole the the I I must say this and I think\h\h

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you agree with me on this uh there's no Panacea to\h
public hearings you can have a public hearing and\h\h

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witness what uh Moultrie and Bray did they went\h
to a public hearing they put on their nice suits\h\h

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and their uniforms or and they they came in there\h
and they they tried their best not to be direct\h\h

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with the American people I resent it as a citizen\h
I resent it as a taxpayer I resented as someone\h\h

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who wants to hear the truth who figures I'm due\h
to hear it one of these days so we've got to\h\h

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get these people wised up before we start hauling\h
them back into public hearings so I hope that the\h\h

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people we're talking about whether it's Burchette\h
uh whether whether it's Matt Gates whether it's\h\h

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any of the people from gillibrand and Rubio and\h
all the other people uh who have been involved in\h\h

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this they need to toughen enough and make sure\h
that the people they are going to put in these\h\h

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committee hearings know that their their testimony\h
means something and if they don't uh take a direct\h\h

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approach with the questions they're going to be\h
held responsible and other people are going to\h\h

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be brought in to comment on whether they're being\h
directly uh honest or not is well this has to end\h\h

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yeah look I agree but but also let's be very clear\h
about this nobody here is suggesting that whatever\h\h

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these objects are they are inevitably anomalous or\h
paranormal essentially all we're asking for is an\h\h

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investigation into the mystery and and the thing\h
that fascinates me in the Daily Mail story that\h\h

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Josh Boswell's done today is that Stratton told\h
the alien con conference and he obviously didn't\h\h

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intend for this to be recorded so somebody's very\h
naughtily recorded this and taken a transcript but\h\h

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thank heavens for posterity that somebody did he\h
said I got an email from the carrier strike group\h\h

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Commander saying Jay we've got some uaap referring\h
to unidentified anomalous phenomena I had a guy on\h\h

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board his carrier within a day in order to start\h
educating start collecting data start getting the\h\h

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folks talking going to each ship in a helicopter\h
and bringing everything back to DC immediately\h\h

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they claim that far from a simple case of a\h
misidentified drone which is if you remember\h\h

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mate what Congress was told Congress was told\h
that these were misidentified drones there was\h\h

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a very clear impression given that what we were\h
talking about here was was drone technology rather\h\h

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than a simple case of a misidentified drone\h
it was a shocking event involving multiple\h\h

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U.S ships swarmed by around 100 objects some truly\h
triangle-shaped that flew for such long distances\h\h

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and times they feared America as adversaries\h
it cracked breakthrough Battery Technology\h\h

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the incidents went on for hours and were repeated\h
through the month now Stratton actually is quoted\h\h

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in the uh in the article from the alien con\h
conferences saying that he had a high enough\h\h

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security clearance to determined that the objects\h
were not us operated we had a much bigger picture\h\h

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he said when we were briefing the seniors The\h
Briefing was very detailed and highly footnoted um\h\h

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it sounds like he and Travis did a very thorough\h
investigation and Jay's basically told the the\h\h

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alien con Moultrie and Bray quote just weren't\h
briefed to the level that I would have prepared\h\h

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them and as Travis Taylor says it seemed odd it\h
felt like we'd been practicing all year got to\h\h

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the playoffs and lost 42 nil it was a real weird\h
kick in the guts now that implied I mean it's a\h\h

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really interesting situation here you've got the\h
former head of the pentagon's UAP investigation\h\h

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program saying they investigated this technology\h
and they could not explain these away as drones or\h\h

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known drone technology that nobody is saying\h
that this is aliens nobody is saying this is\h\h

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Paranormal all they're basically saying is that\h
this is a mystery have the Chinese or the Russians\h\h

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developed technology which allows them to operate\h
some kind of new drone or balloon technology\h\h

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over U.S warships in a restricted training\h
area in a way that's never been done before\h\h

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why this matters and what matters is why were\h
Moultrie and Bray trying to play it down in their\h\h

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evidence to Congress and did they mislead Congress\h
as Jay Stratton and Travis Taylor appear to have\h\h

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told aliencon they were you know I'm just going to\h
go out on a limb here you you're being uh what a\h\h

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good journalist should be you're being cautious\h
you're saying nobody is saying this is aliens\h\h

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that is technically true nobody is saying this\h
is aliens or even paranormal or even anomalous\h\h

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although the name of the office is the all\h
domain uh anomaly resolution office so whatever\h\h

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um here's my problem with continuing to say\h
that while it is possible that Russia or\h\h

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China has come up with hundreds of drone\h
swarms that can be out there doing that\h\h

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um I don't think that's the first explanation\h
that we should be looking for it's a it's an\h\h

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explanation but that's knowable and doable but it\h
doesn't explain the kinds of things that have been\h\h

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reported not just by citizens uh from around the\h
entire planet but by militaries from around the\h\h

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entire planet going back these 75 or 80 years\h
so those things were not Russia or China back\h\h

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in the early days and yet we reported uh through\h
our military many of the same kind of behaviors\h\h

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and some that were even more strange so from my\h
point of view no I'm not willing to say anything\h\h

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is alien alien to many people just means okay\h
they're extraterrestrials they're coming from\h\h

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some place that isn't here to here and they're\h
being flown by somebody that isn't us I get that\h\h

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I'm not saying they're aliens but I'm saying\h
that the more likely resolution of this thing\h\h

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is going to take us into some strange anomalous\h
explanations and that's why I get more and more\h\h

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frustrated by the US Military and frankly the\h
militaries of the rest of the world which are\h\h

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all playing in concert and have been for many\h
decades with the United States on this issue\h\h

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I I'm frustrated that they will not take us to\h
this next level if we're supposed to determine\h\h

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whether they're anomalous alien or plain drones\h
from somebody then how about sharing your work\h\h

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these people have been doing it on our budget for\h
All These Years and they're not sharing their work\h\h

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in fact as you've pointed out and as you and I\h
were appalled to watch on May 17th uh they're\h\h

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they're they're not telling the truth they're\h
trying deliberately to play Down things and\h\h

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they shouldn't be doing that and uh you know\h
we had that same remember on that same show\h\h

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Lou Elizondo was on with us and he was as appalled\h
as we were and and frankly he's been on the inside\h\h

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so I I just I I think it's not going to be drones\h
uh there may there are drones out there but I\h\h

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don't look at this final resolution that we're\h
coming up on hopefully as going as one that lays\h\h

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out the Drone card and says okay nothing to see\h
here for the last eight decades it was all Chinese\h\h

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drones well if it was Chinese drones Ross then\h
they're also time traveling drones because they\h\h

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went back to the 40s and 50s and 60s and I don't\h
think we're talking about that I love the way\h\h

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you always go back to the history mate and it's\h
good it's one of your strengths I just love the\h\h

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fact that as you say there is this incredible\h
Rich Archive of sightings going back 70 80 100\h\h

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000 years you know phenomena that has been seen\h
by Humanity over many many years that cannot be\h\h

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explained including the kind of swarms that we're\h
talking about here let's go on to something else\h\h

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um yeah I don't know if people remember that\h
um oh gosh must have been last year sometime\h\h

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um the philosopher Sam Harris and now more\h
recently Eric Weinstein have both talked\h\h

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about the fact that they have been approached by\h
unnamed purported government officials offering\h\h

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to give them insights about uaps offering to\h
give them information about the secrets of uaps\h\h

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and um on a Lex Friedman podcast recently Harris\h
explained that um let's ask him about it I love\h\h

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Lex's podcasts by the way they're fantastic Harris\h
explained in response to Lex's questions about\h\h

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this I think Eric went down this Rabbit Hole\h
further than I did we were contacted by the\h\h

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same person it wasn't clear to me who this person\h
was or how this person got my cell phone number\h\h

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that they didn't seem like we were getting punked\h
I presume he means tricked there and say what that\h\h

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means this person there was a show that was done\h
uh in the last decade I believe maybe two decades\h\h

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ago called punk and it was basically I think\h
Ashton Kutcher who would literally it was like\h\h

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candid camera but it was on MTV and it was bunked\h
all right okay so so um Sam said this person\h\h

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seemed credible to me and Lex comes in and says\h
so they were talking to you about the release of\h\h

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different videos about uaps and Harris says yeah\h
this was when there was a big flurry of activity\h\h

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around this there was a New Yorker article on\h
UFOs there was rumors of Congressional hearings\h\h

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I think coming and there was the videos that\h
were being debunked or not and so this person\h\h

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contacted both of us I think around the same time\h
what happened Sam Harris says is that the person\h\h

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kept writing a check that he didn't cash it's\h
a great line like he kept saying next week I\h\h

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understand this is sounding spooky and you have\h
no reason to really trust me but next week I'm\h\h

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going to put you on a zoom call with people who\h
you will recognize and they're going to be former\h\h

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heads of the CIA people who within five seconds of\h
being on the zoom call you will know this is not\h\h

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a hoax I said great just let me know just send me\h
the zoom link and that happened maybe three times\h\h

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um and it's worth reading this in full because\h
it's important phone conversation and then a\h\h

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bunch of texts and then I think Eric spent more\h
time with this person and I haven't spoken about\h\h

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it I think he's spoken about it publicly so\h
it's not that my [\h__\h] detector ever went\h\h

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off Sam Harris says in a really big way it's\h
just the thing never happened I lost interest\h\h

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and it's really interesting to me because I've\h
been approached by similar people purporting\h\h

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to be from the intelligence community and they've\h
never come up with the goods either and just part\h\h

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of me is wondering were Sam Harris and Eric\h
Weinstein punked or was there a deliberate\h\h

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attempt by somebody in government to basically\h
give them the impression that at some stage they\h\h

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were going to be I think the way Eric described\h
it Eric Weinstein seems to have suggested that\h\h

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at one stage he was being told they were going to\h
be flown to a Colorado Air Force Base they'd be\h\h

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blindfolded and they'd be taken and shown things\h
which frankly for anybody would be tempting but\h\h

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is it possible they were punked that they were\h
tricked that they were being pulled Along by a\h\h

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Walter Mitty there are Walter mitty's art there\h
and there are people who are purporting to have\h\h

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00:33:56,340 --> 00:34:04,140
government connections who don't well were they\h
punked uh is it possible yeah I mean it's totally\h\h

329
00:34:04,140 --> 00:34:09,840
possible they were punked however um you know as\h
you mentioned you've you've had similar kinds of\h\h

330
00:34:09,840 --> 00:34:16,200
approaches and I I'm semi Infamous because the\h
same thing kind of happened to me during the\h\h

331
00:34:16,200 --> 00:34:21,660
Dark Skies series and one of the reasons that\h
we have had some time off is by the way to our\h\h

332
00:34:21,660 --> 00:34:27,540
listeners and viewers Ross has been working on the\h
US edition of in-plane sight where you've added a\h\h

333
00:34:27,540 --> 00:34:32,280
couple of new chapters and I've been working\h
on preparing a a show that we're going to do\h\h

334
00:34:32,280 --> 00:34:39,060
next uh probably for channel 7 Spotlight Australia\h
where we look into the very case that you're that\h\h

335
00:34:39,060 --> 00:34:43,980
that I'm referring to where my co-creator\h
on Dark Skies uh Brent Friedman and myself\h\h

336
00:34:44,580 --> 00:34:50,160
were either punked or approached by the Office\h
of Naval intelligence I'm not going to say too\h\h

337
00:34:50,160 --> 00:34:55,020
much more about it it's a story that has been told\h
a couple of times but what we're going to try to\h\h

338
00:34:55,020 --> 00:35:00,840
do is uh tell it in the greatest depth that it's\h
ever been told and so I've given a lot of thought\h\h

339
00:35:00,840 --> 00:35:10,620
to this Ross I I think don't bury your lead mate\h
okay we have some amazing new information in that\h\h

340
00:35:10,620 --> 00:35:17,340
story we did and I'm quite excited to tell you\h
yeah we do have a whole new piece of it and and\h\h

341
00:35:17,340 --> 00:35:23,100
the whole Dark Skies thing uh you could do an\h
entire show on what was in darks guys because\h\h

342
00:35:23,100 --> 00:35:28,140
that was it was like the most subversive show on\h
TV when it was on but you could also do a show\h\h

343
00:35:28,140 --> 00:35:33,300
about the behind the scenes of Dark Skies because\h
Brent and I were exposed to a lot of crazy things\h\h

344
00:35:33,300 --> 00:35:38,280
so that we're going to be talking about what do\h
I think about Harris though and and Weinstein\h\h

345
00:35:38,280 --> 00:35:43,500
look it sounds to me like they were approached\h
by somebody who at least sounded serious but\h\h

346
00:35:43,500 --> 00:35:49,560
it also sounds like they didn't get much proof\h
of that this person was who they said they were\h\h

347
00:35:50,280 --> 00:35:55,440
um in which case yeah I can see why they would\h
get uh tired of it I wanted to bring one other\h\h

348
00:35:55,440 --> 00:36:00,900
thing up though on on this topic because um one of\h
the things Harris said that I found particularly\h\h

349
00:36:00,900 --> 00:36:06,360
interesting which is kind of a sidebar issue here\h
but he said quote if this is true this is the\h\h

350
00:36:06,360 --> 00:36:12,480
biggest story in anyone's lifetime contact with\h
alien intelligence is the biggest story in human\h\h

351
00:36:12,480 --> 00:36:18,660
history why isn't that just totally captivating he\h
was referring to the fact that he'd kind of burned\h\h

352
00:36:18,660 --> 00:36:24,420
himself out and he couldn't quite figure out why\h
if this was so important he wasn't uh you know\h\h

353
00:36:24,420 --> 00:36:30,300
all up in arms about it and why his attention\h
was kind of drifting on the topic well I'm just\h\h

354
00:36:30,300 --> 00:36:36,480
going to tell you something that I bet you could\h
almost uh match I've written a UFO book I've done\h\h

355
00:36:36,480 --> 00:36:45,480
UFO series you and I have this podcast uh members\h
of my own family Russ my own family believe that\h\h

356
00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:50,940
I'm that I'm on to something they don't think I'm\h
crazy anymore if they ever did but I don't think\h\h

357
00:36:50,940 --> 00:36:55,980
a member of my family has even read the UFO book\h
I wrote and I don't think a member of my family\h\h

358
00:36:55,980 --> 00:37:02,400
has voluntarily without me pointing uh you know a\h
sharp object at their head actually watched a need\h\h

359
00:37:02,400 --> 00:37:07,500
to know episode now why is that it's not because\h
they don't think it's important it's not because\h\h

360
00:37:07,500 --> 00:37:13,020
they don't want to support me it's because there\h
is something about the topic that is so deeply\h\h

361
00:37:13,020 --> 00:37:18,540
disquieting to at least certain people some of\h
us like you and I are compelled we say this is\h\h

362
00:37:18,540 --> 00:37:24,840
a effin mystery that must be solved and we're\h
willing to devote our our time and resources to\h\h

363
00:37:24,840 --> 00:37:30,300
solving it but a whole lot of other people say\h
yeah I'll spot you that it's probably real but\h\h

364
00:37:30,300 --> 00:37:35,460
I don't really want to talk about it I don't\h
want to listen to a podcast about it and this\h\h

365
00:37:35,460 --> 00:37:41,040
is my own family so I mean I don't know do you\h
have any of the same responses yeah I do it's\h\h

366
00:37:41,040 --> 00:37:45,000
funny talking about again about Sam Harris I mean\h
one of the things he said in the same interview\h\h

367
00:37:45,000 --> 00:37:50,100
with Lex Friedman was that quote he had the\h
impression that no one had had the bandwidth\h\h

368
00:37:50,100 --> 00:37:56,340
to even be interested in this UFO UAP issue and\h
and he said he was amazed that he wasn't more\h\h

369
00:37:56,340 --> 00:38:03,060
interested himself in figuring out what was going\h
on and when he explained this one of the things\h\h

370
00:38:03,060 --> 00:38:09,660
that puzzled and slightly disappointed me was that\h
he seemed to be suggesting that he was buying all\h\h

371
00:38:09,660 --> 00:38:15,840
of the debunking explanations and he cited big\h
West's skeptical analysis of some of the recent\h\h

372
00:38:15,840 --> 00:38:24,120
videos and stated that some of those analyzes\h
seemed like credible debunking um I think he was\h\h

373
00:38:24,120 --> 00:38:31,500
talking about either the um the gimbal analysis\h
that um Midwest has done or maybe he was talking\h\h

374
00:38:31,500 --> 00:38:38,520
about the bokeh analysis that Midwest have done\h
on the 2019 pyramidal objects over the USS Omaha\h\h

375
00:38:38,520 --> 00:38:43,200
and it's interesting because if you balance\h
what Jay stratton's just told UFO alien con\h\h

376
00:38:44,040 --> 00:38:48,660
um Jay Stratton is basically saying that they\h
did verify a pyramidal objects that they're not\h\h

377
00:38:48,660 --> 00:38:55,200
easily dismissed as conventional drones and so my\h
takeaway with this is that there really does need\h\h

378
00:38:55,920 --> 00:39:02,280
it's time for ufology to step up and it's not\h
good enough just to basically put stuff out there\h\h

379
00:39:02,280 --> 00:39:10,200
and make assertions they need to prove it and so\h
if Nick West is providing debunking arguments I\h\h

380
00:39:10,200 --> 00:39:17,040
think those need to be responded to you and I met\h
with Jeremy Corbell and he said categorically that\h\h

381
00:39:17,040 --> 00:39:23,160
whatever though pyramidal objects were over USS\h
Omaha they were not a production of bokeh now as\h\h

382
00:39:23,160 --> 00:39:29,460
I understand it and my brain can't deal with the\h
explanation that Mick um that Mick has to try and\h\h

383
00:39:29,460 --> 00:39:34,020
explain it here in this show as I understand\h
it Mick is basically saying that there is an\h\h

384
00:39:34,020 --> 00:39:40,080
artifact or a lens situation in the camera which\h
distorts the image to such a degree that creates\h\h

385
00:39:40,080 --> 00:39:45,480
a pyramidal object which is not pyramidal and that\h
essentially by implication these objects must be\h\h

386
00:39:45,480 --> 00:39:54,360
stars now whatever the truth is it needs to be\h
scientifically tested and verified and checked\h\h

387
00:39:54,360 --> 00:39:59,520
my worry about all of this is that you know\h
at the moment Sam Harris one of the greatest\h\h

388
00:39:59,520 --> 00:40:05,520
and most of an influential public intellectuals\h
in America if not the world is basically saying\h\h

389
00:40:05,520 --> 00:40:10,620
he's bought the debunking argument and that's\h
fair enough if that's the way Sam feels about it\h\h

390
00:40:11,460 --> 00:40:17,100
and maybe the reason why he feels that way is\h
because basically ufology is Duck and covering\h\h

391
00:40:17,640 --> 00:40:25,380
it's not responding to skeptical arguments that\h
are legitimately being put up from time to time by\h\h

392
00:40:25,380 --> 00:40:30,720
people like Mick West who some people in ufology\h
may not like but he needs to be addressed what\h\h

393
00:40:30,720 --> 00:40:36,420
he's doing is a very useful and real purpose he's\h
questioning which is what we should all be doing\h\h

394
00:40:36,420 --> 00:40:42,000
and and however much people want to believe\h
that he's not correct there's a conversation\h\h

395
00:40:42,000 --> 00:40:48,960
here that needs to be had don't you agree well\h
I do but uh I feel like it's kind of an unfair\h\h

396
00:40:48,960 --> 00:40:55,920
fight because what you have is you have Mick West\h
and and certain people who feel as he do who are\h\h

397
00:40:55,920 --> 00:41:02,580
considered Skeptics and and I agree that is a\h
valid and reasonable thing to do with anything\h\h

398
00:41:02,580 --> 00:41:10,080
that uh looks like it exists outside of normalcy\h
and then there's the rest of uh the people who are\h\h

399
00:41:10,080 --> 00:41:15,960
looking into it people like corbel and yourself\h
and myself and other people but it none of this\h\h

400
00:41:15,960 --> 00:41:23,160
takes into account the third rail if you will\h
which is the forces of governments around the\h\h

401
00:41:23,160 --> 00:41:30,480
world and militaries around the world who actually\h
have done work on this and if they shared even 1\h\h

402
00:41:30,480 --> 00:41:37,080
100th of the work that they've done in the last\h
eight decades it would have a very important and\h\h

403
00:41:37,080 --> 00:41:43,140
valuable impact on our ability to assess this\h
thing instead we're being left to do it on our\h\h

404
00:41:43,140 --> 00:41:49,740
own and and of course we will but you know as as\h
far as Harris though I just think if he's you know\h\h

405
00:41:49,740 --> 00:41:56,100
what uh if he feels that way he should bow out\h
and ask him to find somebody else to breathe in\h\h

406
00:41:56,100 --> 00:42:00,660
if that's the case I wish they would brief you\h
in because the truth is if I had to vote for\h\h

407
00:42:00,660 --> 00:42:06,120
one person who I wanted to be briefed in who Could\h
then brief me and it wasn't me I would I would go\h\h

408
00:42:06,120 --> 00:42:11,280
with you uh when we talk about the secrets of UAP\h
though you know you're going to brief people in\h\h

409
00:42:11,280 --> 00:42:18,960
on the secrets of uaps well think about it would\h
you really fly a couple of guys someplace take\h\h

410
00:42:18,960 --> 00:42:25,380
them into some kind of secret facility to brief\h
them on Chinese drones I I doubt absolutely yeah\h\h

411
00:42:25,380 --> 00:42:30,300
I just really doubt that that would happen\h
you know and I'm I'm being facetious here\h\h

412
00:42:31,080 --> 00:42:37,680
partially at least but if Hera I don't think\h
Harris and Weinstein are necessarily the right\h\h

413
00:42:37,680 --> 00:42:42,000
people for this anyway because the truth is if\h
Harrison Weinstein got briefed in and came back\h\h

414
00:42:42,000 --> 00:42:46,380
out and said well we can't really talk too much\h
about this but we have seen evidence that makes\h\h

415
00:42:46,380 --> 00:42:52,320
us believe X Y and Z uh most people would go okay\h
who is Harris who's Weinstein I mean I'd rather\h\h

416
00:42:52,320 --> 00:42:57,000
they take Stephen Colbert and Tucker Carlson in\h
and then let them go on the air and talk about it\h\h

417
00:42:57,000 --> 00:43:04,860
or something I I just feel like uh the idea that\h
these two guys who listen I enjoy hearing both of\h\h

418
00:43:04,860 --> 00:43:10,800
them talk and I think they're both very bright\h
intelligent men and I think that it's it's all\h\h

419
00:43:10,800 --> 00:43:17,280
positive that they're now focusing at least some\h
of their energies uh intellectual and otherwise on\h\h

420
00:43:17,280 --> 00:43:23,640
this topic but they're not the only guys that can\h
do this and if if uh if they're bored move on uh\h\h

421
00:43:23,640 --> 00:43:28,320
but and if there are people on the inside I don't\h
know whether they're in private Enterprise or in\h\h

422
00:43:28,320 --> 00:43:33,540
the government I would simply say to them those\h
who are listening right now get your act together\h\h

423
00:43:34,500 --> 00:43:41,700
figure out what you can tell in terms of sharing\h
your work start if you have to start slowly start\h\h

424
00:43:41,700 --> 00:43:47,940
sharing it but come on Tom Delong was not the best\h
possible person to share it with if indeed that's\h\h

425
00:43:47,940 --> 00:43:54,000
what happened and neither would Sam Harris or Eric\h
Weinstein be the the go-to guys there's probably\h\h

426
00:43:54,000 --> 00:43:59,340
other uh people out there who could do this as\h
well let's get this process going enough of this\h\h

427
00:43:59,340 --> 00:44:05,880
screwing around I'm tired of it let's let's go on\h
to another issue now Bryce which actually raises\h\h

428
00:44:05,880 --> 00:44:11,880
some of the same issues um Avi lope Professor Avi\h
Loeb from the Harvard University Galileo project\h\h

429
00:44:11,880 --> 00:44:21,120
and the all domain anomaly resolution office boss\h
Sean Kirkpatrick published a new not yet peered\h\h

430
00:44:21,120 --> 00:44:28,140
reviewed article that was co-written together\h
entitled physical constraints on unidentified\h\h

431
00:44:28,140 --> 00:44:36,420
aerial phenomena and a lot of people in ufology\h
took a huge swipe at Professor Loeb for basically\h\h

432
00:44:36,420 --> 00:44:41,880
collaborating with what they perceive to be\h
the enemy Sean Kirkpatrick the head of Arrow\h\h

433
00:44:41,880 --> 00:44:48,000
and frankly I think that's pure Isle I really do\h
I think it's important that there be scientific\h\h

434
00:44:48,000 --> 00:44:52,560
collaboration and if the head of the UFO\h
UAP investigation office in the Pentagon\h\h

435
00:44:52,560 --> 00:45:01,860
is prepared to sit down and write a paper that\h
discusses issues with what objects ordinarily\h\h

436
00:45:01,860 --> 00:45:08,880
do in the atmosphere and how they should behave\h
even how it's not capable of being explained with\h\h

437
00:45:09,660 --> 00:45:14,340
you know there's two explanations that come out\h
in the paper it spends a lot of time speculating\h\h

438
00:45:14,340 --> 00:45:18,780
about how and why an extraterrestrial\h
intelligence would end up in our backyard\h\h

439
00:45:19,440 --> 00:45:25,320
but it makes a whole lot of conclusions about the\h
physics the the limitations with our understanding\h\h

440
00:45:25,320 --> 00:45:30,000
of Newtonian physics behind the sightings that\h
have happened and one of the points that they\h\h

441
00:45:30,000 --> 00:45:36,000
make is that if if in Newtonian physics if an\h
object moves as fast as these objects do in the\h\h

442
00:45:36,000 --> 00:45:41,820
atmosphere these solid objects there should be\h
friction and you know you should be seeing some\h\h

443
00:45:41,820 --> 00:45:49,560
kind of um a heat signature in the U.S Navy videos\h
and they're trying in the paper to explain why\h\h

444
00:45:49,560 --> 00:45:55,200
there was none now a lot of people in the UFO\h
Twitter World basically spend a large part of\h\h

445
00:45:55,200 --> 00:46:00,540
their time and energy attacking Sean Kirkpatrick\h
and Avi Loeb for doing this collaboration\h\h

446
00:46:01,800 --> 00:46:08,700
and I just think that's silly because what they\h
were doing was starting a scientific debate you\h\h

447
00:46:08,700 --> 00:46:14,520
know at the point that they were making was that\h
highly maneuverable UFO sightings indeed appear\h\h

448
00:46:14,520 --> 00:46:20,700
to not abide by the known laws of physics as a\h
bright Optical Fireball should be created by the\h\h

449
00:46:20,700 --> 00:46:27,060
abiding the ensuring friction and so what they\h
were basically saying is that there's a useful\h\h

450
00:46:27,060 --> 00:46:33,420
limit on observations of UAP that that bound the\h
hypothetical explanations and that's known science\h\h

451
00:46:34,200 --> 00:46:38,760
and essentially they're suggesting that there's\h
a problem with the sensors they're throwing it\h\h

452
00:46:38,760 --> 00:46:44,040
back on the sensors and they're suggesting that\h
for example one of the most common sets of data\h\h

453
00:46:44,040 --> 00:46:49,980
within the military Holdings comes from forward\h
looking infrared pods and they provide an accurate\h\h

454
00:46:49,980 --> 00:46:56,280
resolved image of relative thermal measurements\h
and typical UAP sightings they contend in their\h\h

455
00:46:56,280 --> 00:47:02,220
paper are too far away to get a highly resolved\h
image of an object and that the determination\h\h

456
00:47:02,220 --> 00:47:09,240
of the object's motion is limited by the lack of\h
range data now this is relevant Bryce because what\h\h

457
00:47:09,240 --> 00:47:15,840
they appear to be suggesting is that some of the\h
most important videos the gimbal video the go fast\h\h

458
00:47:15,840 --> 00:47:22,080
video all of these objects that have been recorded\h
on in some cases Fleur Imaging have limitations\h\h

459
00:47:22,080 --> 00:47:28,440
because of the limitations of those senses and\h
it's not good enough for us just to basically\h\h

460
00:47:28,440 --> 00:47:35,220
say well obviously it is a new type of physics\h
involved whatever these objects are they are\h\h

461
00:47:35,220 --> 00:47:40,020
um they're moving at speeds that humans have not\h
yet conceived therefore it must be aliens it must\h\h

462
00:47:40,020 --> 00:47:46,920
be anomalous it must be paranormal the simple fact\h
is that what Loeb and Kirkpatrick are doing is\h\h

463
00:47:46,920 --> 00:47:51,900
setting the argument because they're saying that\h
another possible explanation is that we're perhaps\h\h

464
00:47:51,900 --> 00:47:57,900
drawing conclusions from sensor systems which are\h
not equipped to provide us with the conclusions\h\h

465
00:47:57,900 --> 00:48:06,060
that we think we can validly draw do you see\h
my point I do um it's a very complex thing uh\h\h

466
00:48:07,080 --> 00:48:13,020
let's put it this way I'm not affiliated with\h
UFO Twitter although I hashtag them when I post\h\h

467
00:48:13,020 --> 00:48:19,740
on Twitter and and uh there are a lot of really\h
great people in it um I do think uh this sensor\h\h

468
00:48:19,740 --> 00:48:26,220
thing as I read the article kind of set me off a\h
little bit because when we talk about limitation\h\h

469
00:48:26,220 --> 00:48:32,160
of sensors all right and we say well maybe that's\h
the problem maybe that's why we have this issue\h\h

470
00:48:32,160 --> 00:48:37,620
and we can't really tell with what's going on\h
because the sensors are limited well maybe I\h\h

471
00:48:37,620 --> 00:48:43,260
mean or maybe there are better sensors that again\h
have been highly classified and we're not allowed\h\h

472
00:48:43,260 --> 00:48:49,980
to even know they exist I still think that those\h
three videos that came out five years ago there's\h\h

473
00:48:49,980 --> 00:48:55,020
probably really great versions of them that exist\h
I've been told that there are I've been told that\h\h

474
00:48:55,020 --> 00:49:00,360
Congress has seen them so I'm not going to get\h
into sensor bashing here I also have a question is\h\h

475
00:49:00,360 --> 00:49:06,720
what is Sean Kirkpatrick's job why is he writing\h
an article with avilobe at this particular Point\h\h

476
00:49:07,500 --> 00:49:14,880
um I think that Sean Kirkpatrick ought to you know\h
if his job is to run the uh all domain anomaly\h\h

477
00:49:14,880 --> 00:49:20,820
resolution office um I don't think he needs to\h
be co-writing scientific papers he needs to be\h\h

478
00:49:20,820 --> 00:49:25,740
getting that office up on its feet lead lobbying\h
for as much money as he can get to investigate\h\h

479
00:49:25,740 --> 00:49:31,020
things and start reaching hell if you want Sean\h
if you're looking for somebody to write an article\h\h

480
00:49:31,020 --> 00:49:35,520
with you Ross and I volunteer right here and\h
there can I make one point though I mean the\h\h

481
00:49:35,520 --> 00:49:41,520
thing that did frustrate me about the RV load\h
Sean Kirkpatrick paper is that they drew their\h\h

482
00:49:41,520 --> 00:49:46,980
attention their their con their criticism of the\h
limitations of the data to the Fleur Imaging data\h\h

483
00:49:46,980 --> 00:49:52,140
which they know is the only data in the public\h
domain apart from the direct pilot evidence\h\h

484
00:49:52,860 --> 00:49:59,460
now we know that there is other sensor data\h
from the E2 Hawkeye from the USS Princeton\h\h

485
00:49:59,460 --> 00:50:05,820
and the nemis incident uh and from other aircraft\h
in the area we know that the data tapes the data\h\h

486
00:50:05,820 --> 00:50:11,760
disks have been downloaded and what I was looking\h
for in that article was an acknowledgment from\h\h

487
00:50:11,760 --> 00:50:18,360
Sean Kirkpatrick of aaro Ro that that there\h
is in fact other data and he didn't do that\h\h

488
00:50:18,360 --> 00:50:24,360
and I do think it is a legitimate criticism of\h
Professor Loeb that he didn't ask his co-author\h\h

489
00:50:25,020 --> 00:50:29,940
to actually say well where the hell is this other\h
data you know it's all very well focusing just on\h\h

490
00:50:29,940 --> 00:50:34,740
the floor Imaging data and making the criticism\h
that the floor Imaging data has its limitations\h\h

491
00:50:34,740 --> 00:50:40,920
if you're the head of the pentagon's UFO office\h
You by definition have access to all of the data\h\h

492
00:50:40,920 --> 00:50:47,520
including the data bricks which were taken off\h
the Nimitz and the Princeton and that's what I\h\h

493
00:50:47,520 --> 00:50:53,400
think requires explanation from this article I\h
think it's good frankly that the head of a UFO\h\h

494
00:50:53,400 --> 00:50:57,900
program in the Pentagon is being seen to be\h
having a conversation with an authoritative\h\h

495
00:50:57,900 --> 00:51:03,240
Harvard University scientist who's wanting\h
to discuss this issue but frankly if we're\h\h

496
00:51:03,240 --> 00:51:09,120
going to talk about data we do need to talk\h
about all of the data and not be selective and\h\h

497
00:51:09,120 --> 00:51:14,280
cherry picking and moreover I would have liked\h
to have seen in that article an acknowledgment\h\h

498
00:51:14,280 --> 00:51:19,920
that even conventional physics is beginning to\h
acknowledge that there is a possible explanation\h\h

499
00:51:19,920 --> 00:51:26,580
a hypothesis that's been hypothesized with the\h
alcubia drive which is the notion that one can\h\h

500
00:51:26,580 --> 00:51:34,080
distort Pace space time that with adequate energy\h
you can create a bubble in front of a craft which\h\h

501
00:51:34,080 --> 00:51:40,920
basically allows it to move through space and\h
time and I appreciate that's only a hypothesis in\h\h

502
00:51:40,920 --> 00:51:46,800
um quantum physics but it's one that a lot of\h
people are talking about and I would have liked\h\h

503
00:51:46,800 --> 00:51:55,500
to have seen the paper taking that kind of stuff\h
into consideration me too um look I have it's a\h\h

504
00:51:55,500 --> 00:52:00,420
complex thing as I said uh avilo Dr Loeb has\h
become the go-to guy the media needs someone\h\h

505
00:52:00,420 --> 00:52:05,160
to talk about this hey let's get lobe on the line\h
he's a Harvard guy and that'll sound really good\h\h

506
00:52:06,060 --> 00:52:12,720
um but as you pointed out the man is not a\h
journalist he is a astronomer uh from Harvard\h\h

507
00:52:13,500 --> 00:52:19,020
um and he knows a lot but he he doesn't know about\h
follow-up questions he doesn't know about putting\h\h

508
00:52:19,020 --> 00:52:26,100
holding people's feet to the fire you know I I\h
urge uh again uh Sean Kirkpatrick to broaden his\h\h

509
00:52:26,100 --> 00:52:33,480
Horizons a little bit I'd like to see Loeb and his\h
Galileo project um come up with something I'd like\h\h

510
00:52:33,480 --> 00:52:39,060
to see what they're thinking I'm less interested\h
in in media collaborations but you know what\h\h

511
00:52:39,660 --> 00:52:44,220
um we're 50 minutes into this thing I think\h
we should think about wrapping it up and\h\h

512
00:52:44,220 --> 00:52:48,660
one of the things we promised to do and you\h
know thank you for your comments about the\h\h

513
00:52:48,660 --> 00:52:54,180
historical here I I do think that it's important\h
for us to communicate to the people who listen\h\h

514
00:52:54,180 --> 00:53:01,620
to us and people who watch us um that there\h
is a large context to this phenomenon and\h\h

515
00:53:01,620 --> 00:53:08,460
the attempts over the last uh five years to\h
portray it not only in government reports\h\h

516
00:53:08,460 --> 00:53:14,460
but frankly in the the ramifications the media\h
takes from those reports leaves people with the\h\h

517
00:53:14,460 --> 00:53:22,380
impression oh my God this is an acute problem that\h
started in 2004 and as I said uh earlier that's\h\h

518
00:53:22,380 --> 00:53:28,020
not the case you can pick any place in the last\h
eight decades and you'll find hundreds of cases\h\h

519
00:53:28,020 --> 00:53:35,040
if not thousands of cases every single year so\h
just looking back 50 years from uh today into\h\h

520
00:53:35,040 --> 00:53:42,360
1973 uh you know let's face it I just did a very\h
quick little run-through of some of the books I\h\h

521
00:53:42,360 --> 00:53:48,660
have on my shelf and I know you could do the same\h
in your book as one of the good ones but 1973 was\h\h

522
00:53:48,660 --> 00:53:54,060
a year that ushered in a UFO flap they were all\h
over the place they they were even happening in\h\h

523
00:53:54,060 --> 00:54:01,560
the Hudson Valley of New York uh uh 1973 gave\h
us kufos for the first time the center for UFOs\h\h

524
00:54:01,560 --> 00:54:07,500
studies run by Alan heineck and at that time there\h
were three other investigative groups going apro\h\h

525
00:54:07,500 --> 00:54:13,740
mufon and nicap these are four groups looking into\h
UFOs why because because there was something there\h\h

526
00:54:13,740 --> 00:54:18,660
uh and and you couldn't count on the government to\h
do it anymore because they had killed uh Project\h\h

527
00:54:18,660 --> 00:54:26,580
Blue Book in 1969. so people had to do then what\h
we are doing now we're going to step up when the\h\h

528
00:54:26,580 --> 00:54:32,880
government is coming short uh I know also that as\h
I said earlier the juiciest rumor of the year was\h\h

529
00:54:32,880 --> 00:54:38,460
the Nixon Gleason thing but there's also an\h
incredibly high profile abduction case that\h\h

530
00:54:38,460 --> 00:54:46,500
year the the Hicks uh Parker case uh from uh in\h
Pascagoula and that was a terrific one where two\h\h

531
00:54:46,500 --> 00:54:50,880
guys said they'd been abducted hardly the kind\h
of guys to make this up the police put them in\h\h

532
00:54:50,880 --> 00:54:54,900
a room together and record them thinking they'll\h
hear them talking about the hoax they're having\h\h

533
00:54:54,900 --> 00:55:00,600
and instead they're both talking about what it\h
was like to be on board a craft so and and again\h\h

534
00:55:01,140 --> 00:55:07,440
thousands of cases just from that year so I just\h
want to urge people anytime you feel like you're\h\h

535
00:55:07,440 --> 00:55:13,380
getting snowed get a good UFO historical book and\h
start plowing through some of these cases and you\h\h

536
00:55:13,380 --> 00:55:18,480
will be amazed you'll be amazed by a couple things\h
you'll be amazed that there are so many of these\h\h

537
00:55:18,480 --> 00:55:23,700
cases worth talking about and you'll be amazed\h
that many of them sound pretty close to what\h\h

538
00:55:23,700 --> 00:55:30,960
we're experiencing now and uh you'll see that\h
this is something that's not brand new uh it's\h\h

539
00:55:30,960 --> 00:55:35,880
something that's been going on it is a phenomenon\h
and if it's Chinese drones and it means they're\h\h

540
00:55:35,880 --> 00:55:43,920
time traveling Chinese drones I I'm I I guess\h
I guess and by the way I just give you this one\h\h

541
00:55:43,920 --> 00:55:50,520
there's also a great case from Australia which\h
you yourself have covered from 1973 it's one of\h\h

542
00:55:50,520 --> 00:55:55,440
the greatest cases I've ever heard once you give\h
us the short Strokes on that one I've made a lot\h\h

543
00:55:55,440 --> 00:56:01,140
of this case it's um my favorite part of mystery\h
Australia is the North West Cape Harold e Hall\h\h

544
00:56:01,140 --> 00:56:10,740
Naval communication station it's 25th of October\h
1973 and sadly Israel is under attack from various\h\h

545
00:56:10,740 --> 00:56:16,860
Arab states and there's a Mideast arab-israeli\h
war going on and what's happening in the White\h\h

546
00:56:16,860 --> 00:56:23,040
House is the Nixon presidency is falling apart\h
apparently President Nixon's drunk in bed and\h\h

547
00:56:23,040 --> 00:56:27,900
Henry Kissinger is up late at night having to\h
deal with the fact that they're very worried\h\h

548
00:56:27,900 --> 00:56:32,880
about the possibility that the Russians are going\h
to deploy troops into the Middle East and we could\h\h

549
00:56:32,880 --> 00:56:39,960
end up with a confrontation between Russia backing\h
Syria and other nations on one side and America\h\h

550
00:56:39,960 --> 00:56:47,280
backing Israel on the other and it could lead to a\h
nuclear war and so what Kissinger does and this is\h\h

551
00:56:47,280 --> 00:56:53,700
recorded in the White House records of the time\h
is he he orders a lifting in the Defcon status\h\h

552
00:56:54,540 --> 00:57:01,140
I think it went from Defcon 4 to Defcon\h
3 which is the highest defense condition\h\h

553
00:57:01,140 --> 00:57:07,860
for peacetime it's literally at the point where\h
troops are being deployed to be in position for\h\h

554
00:57:07,860 --> 00:57:16,020
war it's where aircraft are being deployed for\h
bombing and what happens at the same time is an\h\h

555
00:57:16,020 --> 00:57:21,840
order goes out to nuclear submarines around the\h
world American nuclear submarines with nuclear\h\h

556
00:57:21,840 --> 00:57:28,200
weapons to essentially be aware that the Defcon\h
status is being raised and that order of most\h\h

557
00:57:28,200 --> 00:57:34,500
Australians still to this day don't know this it\h
goes out from this base in Northwestern Australia\h\h

558
00:57:35,040 --> 00:57:40,140
and it goes out from these very very\h
low frequency antennae just sitting on\h\h

559
00:57:40,140 --> 00:57:44,280
the coast near the Indian Ocean and there are\h
these American Subs way way out in the Indian\h\h

560
00:57:44,280 --> 00:57:50,040
Ocean who because of the signal come further\h
to the surface to get the full command orders\h\h

561
00:57:50,760 --> 00:57:58,620
at around about the same time that that order goes\h
out the deputy commander of the base walks out and\h\h

562
00:57:58,620 --> 00:58:05,340
looks up over the base and there's a charcoal\h
black-colored sphere hovering over the base\h\h

563
00:58:06,360 --> 00:58:11,040
and we know this because he made a written\h
report of it to the Australian Air Force\h\h

564
00:58:11,040 --> 00:58:18,780
sightings investigators and so did a fireman on\h
the base guy called Bill Lynn and he drew it and\h\h

565
00:58:18,780 --> 00:58:25,200
described it to his family afterwards and said\h
that what he saw he thought was alien now that\h\h

566
00:58:25,200 --> 00:58:32,580
incident to this day has never been explained\h
ever and moreover even though the documents\h\h

567
00:58:32,580 --> 00:58:38,760
were provided officially to UAP investigators\h
in the 1980s I think my colleague Bill Chalker\h\h

568
00:58:38,760 --> 00:58:44,520
or my other colleague Keith basterfield those\h
documents that recorded these incidents appear\h\h

569
00:58:44,520 --> 00:58:51,060
to have disappeared from Australian archives but\h
they are real and we know they're real because the\h\h

570
00:58:51,060 --> 00:58:54,120
um the people who were involved at least\h
one of them has described the incident\h\h

571
00:58:54,660 --> 00:59:03,420
so yes price to underline the point that you're\h
making even half a century ago October 1973 these\h\h

572
00:59:03,420 --> 00:59:10,380
incidents were occurring they were unexplained\h
and might as you say they sure as hell weren't\h\h

573
00:59:10,380 --> 00:59:17,580
Chinese drones no they weren't listen uh I know\h
we're wrapping up so let me just uh go back to one\h\h

574
00:59:17,580 --> 00:59:24,480
thing last year as we wrapped up in December of\h
2022 I think we did a show where we were talking\h\h

575
00:59:24,480 --> 00:59:32,940
about whether 2023 would be a Sizzle or a fizzle\h
right uh in terms of UAP UFO disclosure and as I\h\h

576
00:59:32,940 --> 00:59:37,500
recall correct me if I'm wrong but I took the\h
sizzle it was going to sizzle it was going to\h\h

577
00:59:37,500 --> 00:59:43,140
be a big year and I believe you took the fizzle\h
uh that that it was we were gonna put our toe up\h\h

578
00:59:43,140 --> 00:59:49,800
there and pull it back oh you still think it's a\h
fizzle I still think it's a fizzle because frankly\h\h

579
00:59:49,800 --> 00:59:54,360
we're not seeing any hard evidence mate I mean\h
basically at the moment I still think there's a\h\h

580
00:59:54,360 --> 00:59:59,940
pushback I still think that what's happening\h
is that even though our friends Timber Chet\h\h

581
00:59:59,940 --> 01:00:06,720
and others are being shown images uh that we're\h
not allowed to see we're not getting to see them\h\h

582
01:00:06,720 --> 01:00:11,700
we're not getting to see the evidence and when\h
people like Abby Loeb and Sean Kirkpatrick publish\h\h

583
01:00:11,700 --> 01:00:17,640
papers they're not publishing the full data that\h
we know is in possession of the Pentagon if there\h\h

584
01:00:17,640 --> 01:00:23,940
is to be a clear and full public Reckoning on this\h
issue then all of this data needs to be revealed\h\h

585
01:00:23,940 --> 01:00:32,580
publicly and discussed if there's nothing to\h
hide why why continue to lock it up I mean\h\h

586
01:00:32,580 --> 01:00:38,160
just today I noticed that um there's been another\h
Revelation from Jacques valet's Forbidden Science\h\h

587
01:00:38,160 --> 01:00:46,320
Diaries volume Five and it turns out that um on\h
the 26th of March 2004 Jacques valet recorded that\h\h

588
01:00:46,320 --> 01:00:55,500
um Eric Davis uh was told by Bush senior\h
President Bush senior that what happened\h\h

589
01:00:56,640 --> 01:01:05,460
um at the uh uh in the Holloman film the um\h
uh the claims of the uh is it the Holloman Air\h\h

590
01:01:05,460 --> 01:01:12,540
Force Base right um we're allegedly an alien\h
craft allegedly landed was the real thing\h\h

591
01:01:13,320 --> 01:01:19,440
and apparently Eric was told there was a secret\h
project and the security was obscene well frankly\h\h

592
01:01:19,440 --> 01:01:26,640
whilst Jacques valet's diary is hearsay evidence\h
what should be happening to get that as evidence\h\h

593
01:01:26,640 --> 01:01:34,080
as data that we can analyze is people need to be\h
called Witnesses need to be called and questioned\h\h

594
01:01:34,080 --> 01:01:39,660
if he hasn't been already Eric Davis needs to\h
be put before a committee in the Congress and\h\h

595
01:01:39,660 --> 01:01:45,660
questioned under oath and so for that matter does\h
anyone who knows anything about the Holloman film\h\h

596
01:01:46,260 --> 01:01:54,240
why why do we piss around with second-hand\h
hearsay all the time that's my point that's\h\h

597
01:01:54,240 --> 01:02:00,360
what needs to be happening so I'll leave you with\h
this thought uh that is all true and eloquently\h\h

598
01:02:00,360 --> 01:02:09,180
stated as usual so I I'm looking for uh the idea\h
that it's possible that we're going to have to use\h\h

599
01:02:09,180 --> 01:02:15,000
some tools that have been used before to pry all\h
this information out maybe it's a time for real\h\h

600
01:02:15,000 --> 01:02:23,880
activism because uh UFO uh Slash UAP openness\h
transparency disclosure has never really caught\h\h

601
01:02:23,880 --> 01:02:28,140
the public on fire maybe for the very reason I was\h
talking about when I came to my family to watch\h\h

602
01:02:28,140 --> 01:02:35,280
our show but a little activism could go a long way\h
toward demanding some of the things that you're\h\h

603
01:02:35,280 --> 01:02:40,380
talking about and now that we're actually speaking\h
more freely about it maybe that's the time and\h\h

604
01:02:40,380 --> 01:02:47,640
maybe maybe as you know as a journalist one good\h
strong leak could quite a difference make I mean\h\h

605
01:02:47,640 --> 01:02:54,240
look at the uh look at the Vietnam papers that\h
came out in the in the 60s I mean anything could\h\h

606
01:02:54,240 --> 01:02:59,700
happen so I'm kind of hopeful I got I'm still\h
on the sizzle wagon I think something's gonna\h\h

607
01:02:59,700 --> 01:03:05,160
happen I don't know what it is it's going to be\h
surprising and I'm ready to say we're out of here\h\h

608
01:03:06,480 --> 01:03:12,660
well hopefully we'll know sometime this year\h
fizzle or Sizzle I think that's all for need\h\h